Calling a man ‘girly’ isn’t insulting to women, no more than calling a woman ‘manly’ is insulting to men.
It’s insulting towards the person who is being called the term, and really isn’t that nice. But it is not the disparagement of an entire gender to do so.
I have but one question for my charming conservative reader, if I started using “Lee” as a disparaging term to mean “a girl who acts like a cute, but bullheaded Republican man,” would you for a second buy this nonsense that it wasn’t a disparagement of you?
Listen, I’m not going to wait around to bust balls every time a man calls other men ‘girly,” but when men write posts about how men should be respectful of women and then turn around and use “girly” as an insult towards men who are disrespectful of women…in the very same post…
God damn, how can I pass up the opportunity?
Lee, imagine an analogous situation. Say that you walked out on your front lawn tomorrow and found Ted Kennedy passed out drunk, maybe even with a picture of Marilyn Monroe in one hand and a Bill that would stiffen the penalties for killing someone while driving drunk. Could you not write about that?
See?
Sometimes you see an easy shot, you’ve got to take it.
Tiny Cat Pants 
You know, with her being Asian and all, her maiden name may have been Lee, but I digress.
Depends… If a female is called girly, it means that she likes to indulge in the stereotypical feminine. If a child, she likes dolls and playing house. If a woman, it means she likes bubble baths, or wearing perfume, or really obsessing over her hair, etc etc. Essentially, think Carrie Bradshaw. I know I’m using broad stereotypes, but we all know women like this, and to call these women girly is not to insult them, it is to merely make an observation, just as you may call someone shy, extroverted, or “cute but bullheaded.”
Amd if you were to call a male manly, it means that he has certain traits that seem to fit in with the male stereotype: watches football, is physically stout, given to aggressiveness in handling disputes, uses his hands, etc. Essentially, think Terry Bradshaw.
These instances of calling someone of a gender is meant either as compliment or as observation.
Now…. if you switch these tendencies, that is where the insult comes in. For example, if a man constantly obsessed over his hair, like say, a certain former senator from NC who is currently running for President, then that man could be called “girly.” It is not insulting to women to call this former candidate for veep girly, it is only insulting to this actual person.
Vice versa, if a woman was known for being aggressive in handling disputes and could bench press her own weight for reps, then that woman could be called “manly”. It is not insulting to men that a woman of this type is called manly, it is only insulting to that particular woman.
“Listen, I’m not going to wait around to bust balls every time a man calls other men ‘girly,” but when men write posts about how men should be respectful of women and then turn around and use “girly” as an insult towards men who are disrespectful of women…in the very same post…
God damn, how can I pass up the opportunity?”
That though, I can respect. There is no way I would ever think of denying you your verbal assaults on the patriarchy. Might as well deny you food… air… beer.
Another observation, since we’re on this topic…
I had a frat bro in college who had dark curly hair, digged classic blues and country, was an English major, and had politics that were left of center. I could call him Aunt B’ish and not be insulting him or you.
Thinking about it, I think he lives in Tenn, not quite sure. Want me to look him up for you, I think he’s single still.
Aunt B., while I think that men who try to insult other men by calling them ‘girly’ also happen to usually consider women inferior, that doesn’t mean that the two issues are necessarily tied together. The insult isn’t, “you are a thing that is inherently bad”; the insult is “you are a thing that you are not supposed to be.”
Calling a Liberal ‘intolerant’ is an attack. Calling Pat Robertson ‘intolerant’ is high praise. Liberals are not “supposed to be” intolerant. Pat Robertson is required (by his flock, his political allies, and according to him, by his god) to be intolerant.
Calling a Liberal Senator ‘gay’ is an attack (except for Barney Frank). Calling a Republican Senator ‘gay’ is just a boilerplate headline. :)
Lee, I am your frat bro.
Ha, just kidding.
Here’s what I appreciate about having real live conservative readers, because I swear, if I had thought about where this conversation might go, I would have imagined myself saying, “If a female is called girly, it means that she likes to indulge in the stereotypical feminine. If a child, she likes dolls and playing house. If a woman, it means she likes bubble baths, or wearing perfume, or really obsessing over her hair, etc etc. Essentially, think Carrie Bradshaw.” etc. in order to explain to you how it is insulting
But you already get that part of it and don’t think it’s insulting. I find that interesting.
Anyway, here’s the thing. What you describe as “girly” in a grown woman is a woman who spends a lot of time presenting herself as decorative and frilly, useless and frivilous. But what you describe as “girly” is also the thing that we women are told repeatedly, over and over again, is the pinnacle to which we should all strive. We are told repeatedly that behaving like a “girly girl” is the most socially acceptable way for women to behave. “Girly”=perfect woman.
If we weren’t all being constantly coerced into behaving like girly girls, calling a man girly would be, just as you described it–a short-hand way of suggesting that he’s frilly and silly–but not necessarily an insult. But we’ve got it constantly reinforced that “girly” is the best way to be.
Think I’m wrong?
Imagine you have a friend who comes up to you and says, “Hey, Lee, my friend Sarah had a class with you back in college and she’s always thought you were cute and charming and now she’s just moved to town. I was wondering if you wanted to take her out.”
And you say, “Sure, what’s she like?”
And he says, “Well, she’s kind of girly” or he says, “Well, she’s kind of manly.”
Which are you more likely to respond positively to?
WE ALL KNOW THAT!
We all get that it’s better to be girly than manly.
But here’s the other thing–all of the ways you describe “manly,” those are ways of being active in the world. That’s a person who’s not merely decorative. That’s a person who’s engaged in life.
Listen, straight women want to be with men. That’s just how it is. We really want to be with y’all. But when we have thrown in our faces constantly that we must be as girly as possible–even though that’s very few women’s actual natural state–and then you turn around and use what is supposed to be what we strive for, the best we can be, as an insult against each other?
It makes it seem like being a girly girl is actually a shitty thing to be and that no one with any agency or freedom, no one who had the choice would actually find being girly a desireable way to be. So, using “girly” as an insult against men is hurtful to women because it reminds us a.) that the thing we’re told constantly to strive so hard to be is actually kind of shitty and b.) that one gender is stuck with the role of being frivilous and decorative and here’s yet another reminder that it ain’t y’all.
Yet.
I mean, when I’m Queen, and y’all have to perform in the shirtless rodeo and rasslin matches we’ll hold the third Thursday of every month, you’ll get a taste for what it means to be frivilous, but that’s on down the pike yet.
Aunt B., can’t a man be ‘manly’ and frivolous at the same time? What about this?
Oh my.
He has an ax and a small dog.
Folks, go on and give your Aunt B. some private time with the nice fireman.
You can have private time with all of them (the webpage is a little buggy; you’ll have to scroll to the right for all the names).
Which month are you, CS?
As for the rest of this circus:
His definition of manliness includes “given to aggressiveness in handling disputes”?
His poster boy for manliness is Terry Bradshaw?
nuff said
I just like the rhyming. Carrie Bradshaw, Terry Bradshaw… it just happened.
Just look for the most pompous, left-leaning rhetoric, Exador. It was even worse before Shelli’s editing.
Okay, 1. On the computer at home, I could see no names there on the right. 2. Since starting Tiny Cat Pants, I have gotten to eat with some of the finest looking dudes. I am so spoiled.
CS, would it make you embarrassed if I declared today “Swoon over Church Secretary Day”?
Ha, tee hee, I’m sorry. My whole day is ruined by cuteness. Tee hee hee hee hee hee and so forth.
When do the calendars go on sale?
Back on topic, though. I think I see where Aunt B. is going with this. I agree with IC; to call someone “girly” may not be intended as an insult to women. But there is no escaping the sexist provenance of the term.
It is quite similar to the various terms used to classify people of African descent in the history of the U.S.: nigger, Negro, colored, black, Afro-American. These terms have various contexts, and some of them were even advanced by progressives within the community as a way of uplifting the community’s sense of self-worth. All of these terms, however, reinforce the underlying truth that people of apparent African descent are now and have always been the perpetual “other” in the United States.
Likewise, to call a man ‘girly’ is to suggest that he lacks ‘manly’ agency. He is inferior, ergo femininity is inferior. Again, much like the example of “African-Americans,” the intent of the usage is less important than the substance of the term. In fact, the assumed benign nature of such epithets– by masking and normalizing the underlying malevolence– makes the epithets far more powerful than their original incarnations.
I don’t know when the calendars go on sale, Aunt B. It should happen very soon, though. And I don’t think you’re should buy one, unless you prefer yours without autographs.
Oh my!
I want men in skirts.
Can we have men in skirts day? Like every Wednesday?
Yum…
I will not buy one, then. I’ll wait for an autographed one. I will, however, make a post encouraging everyone else to buy one as soon as they are ready for sale.
I wish we could support a charity by having “The Men of Tiny Cat Pants” Calendar–with Church Secretary, Exador, Mack, Lee, Braisted, Lil’ P (give the man-oriented folks a month to study the “cell phone”), Chris Wage, Smiley, Sarcastro, and so on, all posed all manly and hot.
Editor, supposedly Exador and Sarcastro both have kilts, and yet… Just saying.
I wish we could support a charity by having “The Men of Tiny Cat Pants” Calendar–with Church Secretary, Exador, Mack, Lee, Braisted, Lil’ P (give the man-oriented folks a month to study the “cell phone”), Chris Wage, Smiley, Sarcastro, and so on, all posed all manly and hot.
I would buy one for every room!
…supposedly Exador and Sarcastro both have kilts, and yet… Just saying.
…which, as if this should surprise anybody, causes me to wonder if they go commando or not…ah, the imagination is a wonderful thing!
:D
I…
Mmmmmm….
Men in skirts…
Men in skirts with free willies!
Mmmmmm…
Ahhhhhh…
Men have no idea what they would do to the female libido if they’d just start wearing skirts on a regular basis. It boggles the mind.
Mmmmmmm…
Men have no idea what they would do to the female libido if they’d just start wearing skirts on a regular basis. It boggles the mind.
Just wait. While I still don’t get it, there’s been the beginnings of a fad in the gay male community of wearing kilts, and if it catches on, you know the straight guys will copy us for at least a little while like they have on everything from earrings to disco.
Skirts on men would be one metro-sexual habit I would cheer about.
Mmmmmmm…
Man leg…
Man thigh…
Mmmmmmm…
Since my wife and I saw a booth a couple of years ago at Northalsted Market Days that sold leather kilts, she’s been trying to convince me to wear one. I’d be happy to wear a traditional kilt if only I could find a tartan from a clan that shares my surname (which may or may not be Scottish). I don’t want to look like a numpty, though.
some folks seem to think utilikilts are all the rage. me, i’d feel cold.
(i’ve felt cold in a sauna. then again, my US-born partner wouldn’t let me crank it up properly that time…)
According to this line of reasoning, when Ann Coulter indirectly associated John Edwards with the word “faggot”, it should not have been perceived as a homophobic slur. It could not have insulted the gay community, but only should have insulted John Edwards. The only umbrage the gay community could have taken was to be compared to a smarmy southern trial lawyer.